It's not Im not up for a challenge because I've tested out the right gouges for the scales, and to see how i could manage them to follow the twisting curves of the fish. Past few days I also spend on preparing the bodies before i can even think of adding the scales. I've given them a spine and smoothed out their bodies. And their tail vins are almost done.
I pre assembled the pieces, just for fun and to see if and where more work is needed. A good friend of mine pointed out to me how nice the contrast is between the detailing and the smooth skin.
It has made me doubt... so much so that i wonder what to do. And now is the time to think about it cos the surface is still untouched so the option to leave 'm out is still there. My question to you is; what is your opinion, how do you think about it. Shall I leave 'm as they are and just finish assembling? Or shall I ad the scales to add interest, just like these "mythical dolphins" always seem to have in real-life, large original furniture?
ps. Another job that still needs doing; taking out the warp in the marble top. In the picture above you can clearly see the cracks on the left and right hand side of the table top, showing how much curve can occur in a slab of thinly cut stone :( I believe it happened because my workshop is unheated and past winter is to blame. I thought I would let you know, so you can all be aware; marble seems to be just a sensitive to climate conditions as wood.
In my humble opinion and my vote is scales. Not that it is not already an amazing piece as it is. If it is a real life piece and if I am to buy a table like this, my personal taste would have been one with lesser details, ie no scales. But this is a mini and scales will definitely add rather than subtract because details in minis are always fascinating. :)
ReplyDeleteI fully agree with you, detailing in mini's is what it's all about! But one of my concerns was that sometimes the human naked eye is "overfed" (is that correct English?) or the details are just to small to make out, showing a blur instead of richness?
DeleteI would finish the fish with their scales, they don't look finished as they are, and if you complete the table, would you always think it not correct, which would be a shame after all the beautiful work you have done.
ReplyDeleteThank you Marlene, for your reply. It is that same feeling of aggravation afterwards you've described, that is making me cautious to think it out really well.
DeleteI would go for the scales like you originally intended, I did a quick Google image search, there are nice smooth bodies but the heads are smooth too and very realistic looking, like a real one. You already have mythical heads, so I think stick with what you originally intended, you can always make a nice smooth modern realistic one too, ha, see, I like giving you work :-)
ReplyDeleteYah, they come in all shapes and sizes, from basic till elaborated. I researched them a lot and that's what I liked about 'm so much, leaving me the freedom to design my own. And yes, you've understood it were the more mythical (or could you say naive?) ones that inspired me most. The smooth bodies are more to be found in the later (re-)productions, for instance made in the art-deco style
DeleteWith. I see what your friend means with the nice contrast between the smooth and detailed parts of the wood though. But that contrast will still be there, in the head for instance and in the base of the piece. I really think the scales would finish the piece, stunning though is is already. You have given it so much gorgeous detail (love the spine!) I think it would feel like something is missing if you left the tails smooth.
ReplyDeleteThe trials you have made are wonderful, all slightly different. I like the second one from the top. It looks like it has the perfect scale (haha).
You have written down all the same arguments i felt just the same, making me incline to just do it! There will be enough to balance it all out. Still i wanted to consult all you fellow miniaturists out there, cos two always see more then one :) And you see what i saw, they simply need it!!!
DeleteAs for the scale's scale, the second from the top is the proper proportion. The bulk will be that size. But it will be a combination of the top two. They lager ones starting from the end, only to gradually overflow into the smaller ones towards the last of the tail section
Sorry :S , typing too quick ; "starting from the end" should be "starting from the head"
DeleteThis piece is nothing short of breath taking and to alter it's current beauty seems unnecessary but as i look at the piece I still feel that the scales will only enhance the design and add to the authenticity of the fish. Sometimes it's difficult to take that first step to change something that seems to have worked so well, but it's that final step that can take it from a beautiful pice to perfection.
ReplyDeleteBest of luck,
Fi x
I love this piece:) It is very beautiful, but I think it would add the extra touch with the scales, so I vote for that:)
ReplyDeleteThank you!! I'm so happy with your answer :D You've talking away any doubt left
ReplyDeleteScales....
ReplyDeleteI, too, vote for scales but if you think it might be "overdone" perhaps you could make them more subtle? A suggestion of scales rather than a deep impression? In any event, your fish (and table) are exquisite!
ReplyDeleteI also think the scales would add a lot to the piece. I agree with Susan (Tabitha C. ) I like the idea of them being subtle. The table isn't even finished and it is beautiful!!!
ReplyDeleteOoh yes, why not!? Subtle scales are an option too! But hmmmm? Great idea but now you are ádding the options... :D
DeleteI love the contrast between smooth surfaces and high surface worked but I do not think it suits this piece. Fishes seems to me a little naked without their scales, not really completed compared to the wealth of details around them. So I vote for the scales and as Elga for a smooth modern second version!
ReplyDeleteooh no! Opt for both! You are making me sweat here ladies....
DeleteDefinitely scales *nods*
ReplyDeleteBeautiful work Debora
Thanks for your reply, its really appreciated "nods"
DeleteI am in favor of scales, Debora! Do not doubt your original idea! It looks beautiful as it is... because your work is so good.... it will look good no matter what! But I think it will look AMAZINGLY STUNNING with the scales!!!
ReplyDeleteyou leave no ground for doubt, just love it you're so confident and firm in your believe. And now you've converted me :)
DeleteHello!
ReplyDeleteI read all previous comments and ... Well, I always go against the current! as it may seem bare, the fish, I like it like it is, simple, clean and smooth .. maybe I like the art deco? I do not know, but I find this fascinating and very elegant coffee table, as it is now, the scales could complicate the look ... but this is just my humble opinion, but then, you decide! :))
kisses and good Sunday! :))
xxx Caterina
I asked for your humble opinion so please, do speak out. Doesn't matter whether it's against the current or not. Oh no, we all need contrasting idea's and visions to keep the thought process going. And then decide. So thank you Catherina!
DeleteWhile I like the idea of scales I would only do it if the piece was gilded.
ReplyDeleteThe danger of carving in the scales is that all the end grain cuts will absorb more finish and then the darker color contrast of those cuts will most certainly overwhelm the piece. Only do scales if your practice piece shows it can be done without that effect happening.
You are at a point where the finished product is excellent it would be a pity to take a risk without first proving the scales will add to the composition.
First intention was to gild it, but i'll keep it as it is. I love the grain of a wooden version and when i find the time i'll cast it in resin and make a gilded version of it too. So I'm actually carving for a double function.
DeleteThe test piece you see in the pic has been given a lick of oil and because i've undercut the scales just a little the end grain díd indeed show. But i was actually kinda pleased with it. The darkened grain wasn't so much it was too overpowering to me, but the undercut was enough to give a touch of shade on the surface, Cos just like you expressed here too, that shading and hight difference will look very good gilded
My vote is scales!...Hugs
ReplyDeleteThank you Maria
DeleteNo matter what you decide...this is awesome :)
ReplyDeleteThank you Lori
DeleteHi Debora. I vote for scales too. Have you tried making the scales on a piece of round wood? If you find it comfortable to do then go on else skip the scales because the table looks great anyway. Looking forward to meet you again in Castine. We have just booked flight from Copenhagen and then a car from Boston.
ReplyDelete/Niels
Great tip Niels. Ill definitely have a go on round wood too, cos then I can test the gradually transition in scale size at the same time. Cos that's the only part I'm still a bit anxious about. And it's all or nothing at this stage... brrr :S scary but exciting! See you in 8 weeks!!!
DeleteI love your idea of adding scales to the fish. The sample you've shown convinced me. You can do it! It will be amazing too!
ReplyDeleteThank you Kathi. Nice to hear you refer to the sample. I always test and sample idea's to get a better perception of the finished result, and to see if idea's "work" , be it a varnish, or a color combination. Or simple practice a technique. This sample convinced me too :)
DeleteI am so impressed, your carving is exquisite,
ReplyDeleteLucy
thanks Luci, glad you like it
DeleteI vote for NO scales. I love it as it is and it could possibly become too busy. I feel in my opinion there us a perfect amount of detail, a beautiful piece---
ReplyDeleteI'm sorry Linda :/ Your work is always very impressive so I value your opinion, but I've started to scale 'm. I did take to heart some of the comments to be careful not to overdo them so I've not () undercut the scales them selfs. I hope the finished piece will sway your mind?
DeleteTja, wat kan ik nu nog zeggen...
ReplyDeleteHij is al prachtig, dat zonder enige twijfel, maar ik denk ook inderdaad dat de schubben het afmaken.
Visjes zonder schubjes is als een mooie, schone opgeruimde Roombox van jouw hand. 't Klopt niet!? :D
DeleteDearest Debora
ReplyDeleteYou have done such an incredible job! I love it! Especially the detail around the base. I agree with your friend, I think the scales may be a little too much, and you would lose the detail of the spines etc. I wonder if you were able to carve any more detail into the tails? This would give you a little more detail without intruding on the bodies of the fish.
I know you will have the answer soon...
Best wishes
Simon
Your wish is my command Simon :) The tails are far more refine now, i hope you'll like 'm.
DeleteI would definitely add the scales! It's a dramatic piece (the table) which needs the somewhat exaggerated finishing! Sorry, hope I was able to explain myself. English is not my mother language.
ReplyDeleteChristine
Your english is perfect! But I can relate because its not mine either. So ich danken Ihnen sehr. Ich glaube Sie haben völlig richt, Das finish kann es brauchen
DeleteHi Debora,
ReplyDeleteThey both look wonderfull allready but to make it reall you should add the scales.
A shame about the marble top, but won't it work by glueing it to the wood surface?
But you will find a solution for that I'm sure.
Jeffry.
Thank you for thinking along. I wish it could, simply glue it!! But it's out for a good millimeter if you add the two cracks together. That is quit a big gap for such a short piece like this (65 mm long). Remember it's stone and doesn't have that flexibility that, lets just, say wood has. It might warp in the coarse of time, just like wood but it won't bend like it. So it can't bridge that amount. And keep in mind that its only 1.8 mm thick.
DeleteI'll tell you a little secret; i was checking it against the wooden table top to examine the issue. Thinking; What if i would back up the stone with something solid, might it prevent it from breaking? Even if that would work, remember the wood has more "flex" so the marble could bend it all back resulting in a completely bend tabletop? Hmmm, the wood is thinker in comparison, could it hold it all... ? As i was pondering and fiddling with it i never realized i wasn't holding a consistent slice of marble. This one is build up out of various colored chunks. Giving that fragmented tortoise-like look. That's what i love about it in the first place! I was so focused on the issue I forgot that that also makes it more prone to crack, especially at the edges of the color-segments. And that's exactly what happened :(
It cracked along a colorl-ine but that's actually quit fortunate. I glued it back together and if you don't know it you can't see it. Still i want to polish it all over again anyway. So while I'm at it I just grind back the curve as undetectable as can be. Fingers crossed that will do the trick.
I might be a bit late with my comment as you may have already come to a decision but for what's it's worth, I think yes, scales. You really are a wonder with wood. This is a lovely, lovely piece. On the other hand you could leave it sitting out and think "scales" every time you pass it. In time, the right way to go will present itself!
ReplyDeleteYep, you're too late :) But it's OK. The right way to go presented itself and that's what counts. I've decided on scales and just finished them.
DeleteA BIG Thanks;
ReplyDeleteI asked for your opinion and I really want to thank every single one of you for taking the effort to write down your thoughts. Your comments mean a lot to me, cos initially i designed the fish with scales, but somewhere along the way... doubt creeped in. You all helped me back on track for all the right reasons and I'm over the moon with the outcome!!! So many thanks again! I do hope that for the few who suggested to leave 'm bare, the end result will sway them round, cos I'm thrilled how well they work.